Experience Strategy Podcast: The Keys to Employee Engagement with the RecogNATION Podcast

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In this episode, we jam with Neely Adkins and Kailey Savona from the RecogNATION Podcast. As fellow experience nerds focused on the employee side, we discuss the importance of celebrating milestones and micro-moments in the employee journey, emphasizing how vital it is to make every employee feel valued, connected, and heard. The key takeaway? In a world of increasing AI and automation, empathy and human connection will be true differentiators, and as experience strategists, our role is to champion and scale those human-centric cultures. 

Voiceover: [00:00:00] Welcome to the experience strategy podcast, where we talk to customers and experts about how to create products and services that feel like time well spent. And now here are your hosts experience nerds, Dave [00:00:15] Norton and Aransas Savas. 

Aransas: Welcome to the experience strategy podcast. I'm Aransas. 

Dave: And I'm Dave.

Aransas: And today we are joined by our friends Nealey Adkins and Kaylee Savona, and they are the host of the Recognition Podcast, [00:00:30] which focuses on employee experience. And so we kind of figured that if you loved the Experience Strategy Podcast, you'd really love also hearing the Recognition Podcast. We thought it might make sense to [00:00:45] reintroduce ourselves out here at the start so that you can get to know a little bit about what we're doing here at the Experience Strategy Podcast and meet our friends from the Recognition Podcast.

So I'm going to let you guys start. What is the [00:01:00] Recognition Podcast? Why does it exist? What What do you hope to accomplish with it? 

Neely: Sure. Well, first of all, thanks for having us. Uh, this is going to be a lot of fun. I can already tell. So the recognition is really for HR and people leaders. So we talk a lot about work and really [00:01:15] the things that transform organizational culture, that's like a loaded word.

So like if you're in HR or whatever, like, Oh, great. One of these guys. But, but seriously, we, we try to, you know, keep it mixed with, you know, some quantitative data points, you know, if, you know, reports are coming out and studies and we'll, [00:01:30] we'll give you, we'll empower you with those numbers to tell a quantifiable story because a lot of this can sometimes feel a little fluffy, right?

There's not a lot of ROI on investing in employee experience, employee culture and recognition and those things, but then also qualitative, like we can [00:01:45] talk to leaders and, uh, HR folks that are coming from different organizations and different industries that are. You know, you would think, Oh, that person is, you know, in a completely different industry that their experience is not relevant to me at all.

And then we've heard like so much feedback. Like I had [00:02:00] no idea the dude in an auto plant in Ohio had anything to do with my pizza shop in California, but look at this. So really it's just a chance for people to get together and talk about people and talk about how we are going to do this thing called work together.

And at the end. [00:02:15] Uh, and enjoyable Kaylee Savona is my partner in crime. Kaylee and any additions and thoughts to how, how, how would we talk about ourselves? 

Kailey: Yeah, I mean, you said it all Nealey, there's not really much for me to add here. I would also just say we're out here just trying to put that like positive [00:02:30] spin on things when it comes to the workplace because right now in social media you just have so much negativity, got a lot of burnout, people don't want to work and we're over here like, hey, we can make the experience fun and we can make it something that employees want to come to work for.

So. I love that [00:02:45] so much. 

Aransas: Yeah, at the experience strategy podcast, we're doing a lot of the same in many ways through a somewhat different lens, uh, in that we are as well, uh, doing both quant and qualitative research to really understand what [00:03:00] customers want. And our customers are both internal and external for our clients and for our listeners.

And. When I say that, what I mean is, as Nealey said, they're human beings and these human [00:03:15] beings are what make up companies. And ultimately, without our employees, without our customers, there are no companies. There is no value produced here. And so we're really focused on taking care of people. [00:03:30] Those human beings and helping to ensure that their needs are met, that their needs are known, I guess, first of all, and that companies are really paying attention to what matters to their internal and external customers.

And so here on our podcast, we [00:03:45] talk to leaders from all a wide range of industries, both about those internal and external customers and try to learn together about what really works for customers now and not just what's worked, you know, for the last hundred years. [00:04:00] Uh, and that all comes down to the human experience.

And luckily when you talk to experienced strategist, you tend to talk to humans who like humans, who care about humans. And so it's, Super, super fun. Uh, Dave, [00:04:15] as my cohost, anything you want to add? 

Dave: Oh, I think you, I think you hit it on the head. We're in our 100th episode year, I guess, or something like that.

Hey, congrats. It's a huge thing to think about. [00:04:30] So we've been working this gig for a little while and we, and we've really enjoyed it. Yeah. 

Aransas: So as you listen to what Neely and Kaylee are What do you think that listeners at the [00:04:45] Experience Strategy Podcast would be most excited to hear about or explore?

Dave: Well, I love what you guys are doing. I think it's absolutely, um, important, um, to make work, um, More [00:05:00] enjoyable, um, more experiential. And you're right. People are just burned out and we need new tools that will help us to think about how to empower people in all parts of their [00:05:15] lives. You're looking at the work life and, um, we look at that, but we also look at, at the, um, in their personal life as well.

And I'm wondering what are you guys finding are. [00:05:30] Techniques or tricks or tools that empower people. 

Neely: Dave, it is so many things. So that's, that's the answer. Um, you know what, and we try to be cute and like markety about it, right? Uh, we, we have four pillars of an engaged [00:05:45] workplace. Basically if you're able to answer a set of four questions, you can get a good sense of how engaged your employees are.

Do I feel recognized? So do people realize the value that I'm actually providing around here or at somewhat to the level that I think I'm [00:06:00] providing value. Do I feel connected? Am I part of a larger movement here? Am I part of a bigger team? Am I aligned with that team? Am I communicated with effectively?

Like am I informed? Do I know what's going on or am I left out of the loop because I'm, you know, a front [00:06:15] level employee or, you know, I'm out on the floor or something like that. And then finally, am I heard? So do I actually have a say in this? Or am I just like an unwilling passenger on this train that's moving and you might fall off or hang on?

It's kind of irrelevant because this is the [00:06:30] way we're going. So I think in the conversations that we have, we kind of always fall back to, you know, a sense of connectedness. A sense of appreciation and then a sense of communication. Like, is this a two way street of communication or is it just, you know, I, I get my morning announcements [00:06:45] on the intranet and then I go about my job and then I clock out and then I go home.

Like, where's the meat there? Where is that connective tissue? And I'll say. Similar to how you were mentioning how customers expectations have changed, employees expectations have changed, uh, recently as well. Like, [00:07:00] especially, you know, COVID pushed a lot of people over a giant cliff on meeting the expectations of employees.

And that's where we saw the great resignation. People were sick of it. They threw up their hands and they said, you know what? I have the ability to now work anywhere. I'm not now [00:07:15] geographically confined to the people that are hiring in my area. Cause guess what? I can now work virtually. So I have value to add.

And if you as a company don't see the value that I have to add, I'm going to go find somewhere else that does recognize that. And then allows me to offer that value in a way that I'm more [00:07:30] comfortable. So really over the last four years, kind of a reckoning of trying to get these misaligned employee expectations versus employer provisions, uh, has been incredible to see.

And we've just been kind of talking about this all along the way and bringing in [00:07:45] different stories and, and basically echoing those same type of sentiments and saying like, Hey, if you can get these foundational pieces together, you know, you're going to end up with a great culture. Don't force the issue.

But these are the things that you should be concentrating on if you're an HR or a people leader in [00:08:00] your organization. 

Aransas: That's so good. And I think you're right. There was, this was a long, a problem a long time in coming. And the pandemic was really an inflection point that. Broke the camel's back, I guess.

I don't, I'm like 15 metaphors. [00:08:15] That's how I do it. But I think those, those principles really resonate with frankly what customers want to, right? They want to feel connected to a brand. They want to feel a sense of [00:08:30] appreciation and they want good communication, right? And all of that, we were talking in our last episode, and if you haven't listened to that, please go and check it out.

We were talking about psychological safety and the importance of that. Within this [00:08:45] relationship that is forged between a company and an employee and how vital that is. But the, that psychological safety needs to exist for the customer too. So it's like, I think these are, these are principles that if you can get them right in one area of your company, you are more likely [00:09:00] to get them right in every area.

But if you get them wrong, you're probably gonna get them wrong everywhere. And ultimately, that's why so many companies fail despite. Great ideas, or [00:09:15] even great strategic innovation. 

Dave: Are you guys finding that there's a different type of recognition that people want today? Or a different way of communicating that people want today?

Have [00:09:30] things changed, uh, from, from that standpoint? 

Kailey: I think there's two major things that we've noticed. One of them is just preferences. People don't want the cookie cutter recognition and way of engaging where everyone's getting the same [00:09:45] thing. They don't just want that everyone gets the same trophy for this.

Everyone gets the same reward. People love when they're seen it. They love when people know what they like and they're, they're recognized that way. And I would also just say like, well, I guess those two [00:10:00] go hand in hand. It's personalization and it's preferences and also just remembering, okay, some people don't like public recognition.

Some people want that private recognition. So I really think it's all about preferences and keeping things fresh and unique, not having those cookie cutter ways of [00:10:15] doing things. 

Neely: And if I could add just one more thing. So I think our first episode was actually titled The Recognition Revolution in which we had our CEO, you know, Baudville is a company that was founded in the 80s and they literally [00:10:30] built a business on certificate paper, right?

So it's like ways to give out these awards, right? I think the, the change is moving recognition. From a milestone based initiative into a day to day initiative. [00:10:45] I think one of the trends recently that's driven, uh, even higher importance on this is the average tenure is like three and a half years. I'm not even making it to my five year anniversary to get that trophy, right?

So, Of the company [00:11:00] enabled recognition, I, the majority of your employees are never even making it to that first milestone. So the need to recognize folks more often, you're getting closer to day to day. Right. You've, you've heard the idea of, you [00:11:15] know, finish line. Congratulations. Right. Once I've finished the race.

Well, what about the motivation as we're on miles one, two, three, like, and then having the vision. on that work that's being done on a daily basis. Now it's you're taking it out of the hands of a [00:11:30] company that is only recognizing maybe a key milestone of a work anniversary and a birthday to taking it out of the hands of a manager that's maybe only having two significant feedback sessions with you in a mid year and an end of year review.

And you're putting it into the power of your peers [00:11:45] because your peers are the ones that are working with you every day. They understand how hard you're working. They understand, Hey, I know, How difficult that presentation was. And you just went in there and you kick butt and you need to be like, you need a high five for that.

And that is what is motivating. And that is what people are [00:12:00] so desperate for is the recognition of in the moment, the specific feedback that that is something that you just did. And that was awesome. And then also for it to come from other peers, because that is making me feel more legitimate. That is making me feel like I'm on the right track.

I'm doing the right thing. [00:12:15] And then that ladders up into, okay, now managers are now seeing all of this activity. They have more eyes on the ground to then better inform those one on ones and the regular check ins as a employee to manager relationship. So I think that's another big trend too, is getting more [00:12:30] into those micro moments instead of just the bigger, you know, service anniversaries.

Dave: You know, it's interesting, uh, as you were talking, it reminded me a lot of some of the things that we're seeing on the consumer side where [00:12:45] people really respond really well to milestoning. And what I mean by that is, They have all of these different trackers in their own lives, right? They have a number of steps that they're going to take.

They know the number of [00:13:00] calories that they want to burn. They know whether or not their sleep was good sleep last night or not. And so they have a lot of data that they're using to improve their performance. Thanks. Thanks. [00:13:15] And there's something about when you've accomplished something and there's some sort of recognition for the accomplishment of that milestone, that's really empowering.

Historically, experienced strategists have been [00:13:30] focused on designing for a particular moment. And, you know, that may be a recognition moment. Um, but they haven't really thought of it as a milestone. And what I like about this idea is it's [00:13:45] trackable. It's data infused. It helps the, the user of the milestone or however you think about it, the person who's, who is being rewarded for accomplishing that particular milestone.[00:14:00] 

It helps them to think better about themselves and hopefully they have more control over, Uh, the milestone, they, they get to set the milestone, they get to work towards that particular goal. I wonder what [00:14:15] your thoughts are about this idea of milestone. 

Aransas: I'll jump into an ad that this is something we did a lot of work on when I was at Weight Watchers because of course that is a journey that is marked by a milestones, but it's a really long [00:14:30] sludge for most people and it can feel like you're making billions of tiny choices that are hard.

without making progress. And it kind of sounds like the workplace, uh, in many cases, [00:14:45] billions of tiny choices that make for one big end goal. But I think for us, what we found is that it was vital. To keep engagement high by celebrating the milestones within [00:15:00] the journey. And we ran a few tests that I thought were really surprising and interesting and worth sharing here, including looking at actual physical mementos, like Low cost value, but high [00:15:15] perceived value.

Mementos historically had been given out, you know, kind of like an AA chip in the Weight Watchers meeting for decades. And we all knew that there was a high perceived value by those who received them, but we also knew we [00:15:30] had 50 percent of our membership at the time who weren't in that environment, who were strictly a digital customer.

And. Who were showing less progress at the time in terms of their weight journeys. And so one of the tests we ran was to [00:15:45] understand if we actually signified with a hard relic or a memento, these milestones, if it would improve outcomes. And, in fact, it did cost more and, in fact, it did ultimately [00:16:00] reward us with longer retention because those people were more appreciative of their progress.

They were more aware of their progress, but they also, and I think this is the important piece that we haven't touched on yet, they knew what the mile [00:16:15] markers were. because we were giving them a POV on what success looked like beyond a final outcome. And, you know, we talk a lot about point of view as a big part of experience strategy, but I think this is a really good example of that.

[00:16:30] You need to have a POV on what your milestones look like because as humans, we want to be successful. But if you don't tell us what success looks like and then have some way of recognizing it and rewarding it, [00:16:45] then did it really happen? 

Kailey: Right. You are 100 percent speaking our language because our tagline is literally every moment matters.

So with milestones, we could not agree more. Like Nealey said, I mean, employees aren't making it to that five year mark anymore. So we're [00:17:00] seeing employ, we're seeing clients implement three year awards, one year award. You've been here one year. Um, and then beyond that, like in our tech platform, we have our moments feed.

So that is meant to be those daily. Connections and those daily [00:17:15] shout outs. Oh, look what this team did today and beyond that too We've also started building out milestones for giving that recognition. So in our enhanced profiles people can see Oh, the next milestone is sending 5 e cards or the next milestone [00:17:30] is making 10 moments posts so just being able to Even see the recognition you're giving to others is rewarding for people and hitting those different milestones.

Neely: What's fascinating about this is what we're talking about is gamification, [00:17:45] right? So we're talking about, you know, laying out a path to success and how desperate have employees been to just tell me what path to go on and make it clear what those expectations are. [00:18:00] That that's, that's alignment, right? So I think not only is it important, you know, from a peer to peer recognition standpoint to get the shout outs along the way that feels good.

I can also, you know, incentivize certain behaviors and [00:18:15] actions to align with our company core values. Like if I want to do that for, for an organization. Talk about annual objectives, OKRs, however your, your company strategizes, you understand, you have to understand that's a team of executives sitting in a room for like a [00:18:30] week and then writing stuff down and then putting on our PowerPoint presentation and then are like maybe reciting it back to the team, you know, once a quarter or something like that.

How in the world is an individual contributor able to understand how my day job [00:18:45] contributes to that overall goal. So this is more than just peer to peer recognition. This is a way to get to these micro events, these little milestones. I think it's, it is the perfect word for it to say, Hey, on paper, here is what we need to accomplish [00:19:00] in this set of time, whether that's a week, a month, a quarter, and this is how this rolls up into this objective.

And if we're able to accomplish all of these things, This is how as a team we're going to be successful. And then you have regular check ins with your manager. Maybe that's [00:19:15] every other week, just 30 minutes every other week. And you're reviewing our progress against that agreed upon plan. The amount of velocity that you're going to get out of your team, the amount of engagement you're going to get out of your team is going to be transformational [00:19:30] because for once they have a plan in front of it, and it is pretty black and white, that this is what is expected out of me, here is what I will be rewarded for, these are the behaviors and actions that I can do that align with the company core values that will also be recognized for.

You're [00:19:45] giving them the playbook. And if I want to come to work and then just follow the playbook, that's, that's a winning solution. So, so I think gamification is a little bit of it, but I think ultimately it's, it's aligning the employee's work and contributions to what the company objectives are. 

Aransas: Yeah, [00:20:00] that's exactly right.

And we do some pretty large scale quant studies every year to understand employee engagement. As a part of the experience strategy collaboratives program that we run. And so our clients from different categories say, [00:20:15] Hey, I need to understand what my customer wants internal or external. And then we go off and ask these questions specifically of their customers.

And for the past few years, we've seen a real uptick in the importance of [00:20:30] purpose. Now we all know that being on purpose matters, but what is particularly striking about this data is how much it matters when compared to getting paid, [00:20:45] right? Like we think that's the thing you want to get paid. And it's true.

We all want to get paid. But part of the reason we want to get paid Yes, so we can pay our bills and feed our families and have a roof [00:21:00] over our heads, whatever. But it's also because it's a signal that we're valuable, that our work matters. And when we extrapolate that data, I think what we see in there is that [00:21:15] people care most of all about making a difference.

And that means not just in the outside world, but that also means the corporate strategy. And I think what you're describing is frankly, it's It's really hard [00:21:30] work to get to that sort of plan because it takes teams actually aligning and it takes strategies actually becoming projects [00:21:45] and then it takes discipline to stay true to those and the best companies are really good at it and the messiest, most fractured, failing companies are the worst at it.

And so it's like, I think it is. [00:22:00] One of the most vital investments a company can make up front and I, that where you use the word velocity, I was like, that is the word Nealey because it's that whole move slow to move fast thing. We've got to slow down and make the, [00:22:15] do the work to get to alignment if we want to have teams that are empowered and moving quickly.

Neely: You mentioned that's what makes me feel valued, right? So it is, is it the outcome of my work? And that is fulfilling to me, [00:22:30] or is it the dollar amount that's on the paycheck that comes to me every week or whatever? I think what's fascinating is that in this great resignation wave, one of the questions that these employees were asking [00:22:45] themselves was, is the work I'm doing making a difference?

And like, just think generationally, right? So like, think like post World War II. It's not like, is the work I'm doing making a difference? No. No, it is. Is this like. [00:23:00] a job that I can hold for a long amount of time. Uh, and then, you know, it is seriously a nine to five clock in clock out and then just get out of there as soon as possible, right?

How people thought of work has changed. And so if that's the [00:23:15] case, if you are a company trying to employ and or recruit people, you have to be considerate of that, which means you've got to reconsider, okay, what are, what are we, what's our purpose, what's our vision, what's our mission, all those kinds of things.

Instead of just the, the words that are [00:23:30] on the stones out in front of the company offices. How has that come to life in your people? How are your people living out these core values? Because if they're not, then this is just the same inauthentic workplace that I've seen hundreds and thousands of [00:23:45] times.

The trap here though, and I want, I want to caution this because this does sound like utopia, right? And it's like, man, if I could do something that I'm really good at, For a company and a purpose that is actually doing good for the world and they pay me like a decent salary I could stay here the rest of my life [00:24:00] the problem with us, especially as americans is that we tie Our work product to our personal worth our ego is so tightly connected To the work that we do And the [00:24:15] reality is you have good days at work and you have bad days at work and your companies have good years of business and your companies have bad years of business.

That cannot be a reflection of your self worth. And I think that's, that's [00:24:30] the trap here is that people are like, dude, I'm going to go find this company that we're like symbiotic. My values are aligned with them and then we're just become this intertwined being. You've now latched yourself. On to an entity in a company that is [00:24:45] meant to be volatile and you as a person are not meant to be volatile So I guess that's that's the trap That's that's the watch out here is that as awesome as it is to see a person That's in the perfect fit job that is [00:25:00] motivated just by the idea of who they are working with and what they're working for The trap for that person is that are they too intertwined and are they attaching themselves in their own sense of value to the outcomes of what that job is?

Because at [00:25:15] day, we're, we're human beings. We're not human doings. The job is just the job. Okay. As awesome as we're trying to make this all seem, a job is a job. And so, you know, be cautious when, when trying to attach yourself so closely. 

Dave: Interesting. You know, um, one of the [00:25:30] things that experienced designers, I think, struggle with is that they design for the ideal.

So they're constantly creating moments to turn experiences into kind of the [00:25:45] ideal. And to your point, Nealey, we live in a volatile world. There's a lot of volatility. That occurs. And because of that, it's not always going to be ideal. And I think in most people's lives, they recognize [00:26:00] that the ups and the downs, but as designers, we have a tendency to celebrate the ups, correct the downs, to try to create.

A situation where it's almost always headed up, [00:26:15] and that's just not the case. One of the things that I wanted to do last year in our collaboratives, which are, by the way, our collaboratives are a year long program where we work with 10, up to 10 companies and they go [00:26:30] through a lot of research and they study a lot of topics and they work alongside of each other and they're trying to solve for their own business problems, but they're also trying to solve For larger topic areas.

And one of the topic areas that I wanted to go after was [00:26:45] uncertainty. Uh, how do you design for uncertainty? It's easy to design performance for the ideal, but when you're dealing with global wars, you know, a [00:27:00] pandemic, 

Aransas: like 

Dave: all of these different things at a macro level, those, those things, you know, Inflation, they have an impact on people's lives.

Volatility in interest rates, all of these [00:27:15] things are impacting people. And I, I don't think we take enough time to think about how do we design for, how do we strategize for supporting people through uncertainty and I wonder if you have any thoughts on that. 

Neely: Yeah. [00:27:30] So as part of any of those, you know, giant macro influences, you know, the first thing that people are concerned about are.

Am I going to have, you know, the paycheck coming in on a regular basis, right? So you'll see a lot of people go into [00:27:45] defense mode, right? And it's like, okay, I can meet expectations and keep my head down and just get through this. And that's what is going to get me to the other side of this uncertainty.

What is interesting is, you know, you've [00:28:00] got Plenty of scientific explanations for like how the humans are reacting to, you know, certain environments, right? So if I'm on my hierarchy of needs, I'm immediately going straight down to the bottom, right? So forget all of this self realization like I'm down [00:28:15] in the food and shelter area at this moment So, you know work plays a big deal.

It plays a big role in how people are getting through those type of moments So it is on the employer. It's on the manager Even at the most close level is to provide that sense of [00:28:30] security, right? Three questions people are asking themselves every day. Am I safe? Am I connected? Is there a shared future?

Safety during the pandemic had a couple of meetings, right? It was, you're going to ask me to come back to work. What, like what, [00:28:45] what does that, what does that look like? What does that mean? I'm now physically questioning. Am I safe? Not alone? Like, am I safe at this job? So if, if we're struggling on question number one, where are we on, you know, rising up in that pandemic?

Uh, hierarchy of needs, where are we on getting to a level of, you [00:29:00] know, connectedness and then a shared future. So yeah, I would absolutely say that what you are investing in every day with your employees and your teams is that inevitable question of, am I safe? And they need [00:29:15] something to fall back on.

They, they need examples of, you know, when times get tough, am I able to rely on you as a team? Am I able to rely on you as a manager? Am I able to rely on the company as a whole? 

Aransas: How's anybody doing that right now when it feels like [00:29:30] every company is reorg ing and conducting layoffs? I, I, is it just me? I feel like we're past the great resignation and now we're in the great layoff.

I know many more people who have been laid off recently than who have [00:29:45] voluntarily left an organization. So I, I don't know, is it even possible to create that sense of safety in what feels like an employee population churn? 

Kailey: Yeah, no, that's really tough. And it's also, once [00:30:00] you have those layoffs happening, the people that do stay don't feel safe anymore either.

Like, how do you create that sense of like, okay, this just happened, but we promise your jobs are okay. And we promise that there's still a future for you [00:30:15] here. 

Aransas: For the good of the company and for you. So forget that happened. It won't happen again. 

Kailey: Yeah, I think it's so difficult. And I know from personal experience here.

It goes back to that pillar of voice and [00:30:30] communication, just the transparency. Because whether we have a team member voluntarily leave or we have a layoff here, there's a lot of communication. Our president speaks directly to us and we're a small brand that maybe that's one of the luxuries of working for a small company.

Is [00:30:45] having that vulnerable moment of sitting down and being like, I know we loved this person and this sucks and just sitting in that for a moment and then moving on to this is where we're going to go next. This is how this role is going to be filled, blah, blah, blah, [00:31:00] reorganization, all that. So I think it really goes back to that transparency and communication.

Aransas: Yeah. I mean, I think it goes back to all three of your principles, honestly, connected, appreciated, and communicated with. Right. And, but I think you're probably [00:31:15] right, Kaylee, that that last one is the most essential. 

Kailey: Mm hmm. 

Aransas: So. I know we're rounding out and running out of time. Is there anything super important that Well, 

Neely: I mean, it feels like, it feels like you're hosting us and we're not asking the appropriate level [00:31:30] of questions back to you.

There's so awesome of questions. You guys are professionals. How does the stuff, you know, that we're talking about here, how does this resonate in the work that you're doing? So, you know, as we, as we talked about at the open, you know, it's really just [00:31:45] humans being humans, right? And interacting with, with each other, assuming different roles.

How important is employee experience and then what are the ripple effects of an engaged workforce into, you know, into the situations in which you're observing or, you know, the scenarios in which [00:32:00] you're doing your work every day? 

Aransas: Yeah, I mean, so what we do at our company, Stone Mantle, is we help other companies create experience strategies.

And sometimes those are internal, sometimes they're external. Ideally. They're both. [00:32:15] Ideally, your experience strategy aligns your employee experience strategy, your customer experience strategy, and your business model. And that that is all one unified strategic process. That's a Z. We work with [00:32:30] many companies that are.

Much older than the idea of experience strategy, uh, and get to shape that. But what we're always trying to do is to help those customers, our customers, the companies we work with, have a really strong point of view [00:32:45] about what their Customers want and need and value. We're helping them collect the data that's needed to validate that, to advocate for the customer's needs.

And then we're really helping them [00:33:00] translate that into a meaningful experience. For their customer. And, and, you know, I think the intersection here certainly is that sometimes that means recognition and reward need to be amplified. And other times it [00:33:15] is maybe a little earlier in the journey and it's, it's just getting clear on who you are and the problems that you solve.

Dave: And there are just some really important big things that are occurring. One of the things that Aransas has led for us is our [00:33:30] trends report from year to year. You know, the number of people that feel lonely continues to go up. Loneliness is a big issue. For a lot of people in all different parts of their lives.

The uncertainty that we were [00:33:45] talking about is a really big issue, but then there's some positive things too. Like people really expect artificial intelligence to lead to them having something akin to superpowers. [00:34:00] And. That's pretty exciting. I mean, I'm not going to tell you who it is, but I had a family member who's like, had a change in his role where he went from vice president [00:34:15] to, um, to president on a temporary basis.

And he was like, I have no idea how to prepare a board meeting presentation. Right. And he jumped on chat GPT and [00:34:30] he said, show me what I need to do. And he was able to figure out the basics of, of doing a board presentation, even though he'd never done one before. That's, that's amazing. 

Aransas: [00:34:45] It's amazing. And what I think is so exciting about that is he did know a lot of things.

And so I think we, we get scared talking about. Uh, artificial intelligence by thinking like it's going to [00:35:00] do all the things, but no. What it's doing is it's taking what he already knew and translating that, creating greater velocity and allowing him to overcome the hurdle of, I don't know, more quickly.[00:35:15] 

It's super charged, super powered Google. And, and I think you're right. The adoption rates of AI are. off the charts and, and, you know, I think that, that hockey stick is one of the greatest of all [00:35:30] times. Um, but it is, it is an exciting time in terms of people trusting technology as a 

Kailey: partner. Yeah. I think that's very refreshing to hear it referred to as a superpower because I think there, [00:35:45] I, I feel like we're still hearing about fears and yeah, Oh, technology is going to take over.

AI is going to take all these jobs. But like you said, it's not that the AI is the smart one. It's all about what you input into it. [00:36:00] So it's almost like a confidence booster and it's a way to enhance what we already know. It's not going to take anything from humans. It's going to just be a superpower. I love it.

Dave: It's funny because Elon Musk is always doom and gloom about. generative [00:36:15] AI, but he's starting two totally different AI initiatives, one in Memphis, or in, yeah, I think it's in, it's in Tennessee, I don't know where. And then of course, what he's doing with [00:36:30] Tesla. And so, Give me a break. These are really, really important and empowering things that are going on.

And I think the ultimate, it'll ultimately be a win for the consumer as well as for the [00:36:45] employee. And I think we will be much more successful. So there's a lot that is changing and evolving. As we speak, uh, you know, remote work, we could have talked about that the entire time, right? [00:37:00] And so it's an exciting time to be doing experience strategy.

I worry that many companies are kind of stuck in kind of a 90s mindset, where all you have to do is create a persona, [00:37:15] maybe do a journey map, um, maybe measure NPS and you're good. Um, that's maybe 2000s kind of mindset. I think there's a lot more that we need to be paying attention to if we [00:37:30] really want to help people.

Aransas: I think. Um, everything we've talked about today really comes back to time value too, though, right? And that's what most experienced strategists are missing. And whether it is the employee or the [00:37:45] customer, it all comes down to are you making good use of my time? 

Kailey: Mm hmm. 

Aransas: And AI is a great way to make good Good use of someone's time.

Right? So it's a good example of that, but it's also an example of where we're [00:38:00] spending more money and spending more time experientially. And so one of the things we were really excited about this year was the performance of immersion and how more big companies for both brand value and [00:38:15] experience value are investing in, in hardcore immersive experiences.

And I mean, they are making massive. Investments in these, are we seeing financial return on those massive investments right away? No, but we're seeing [00:38:30] massive brand value. And I think that's really the future here is that because, and I, I think often that those are probably the two biggest root drivers of [00:38:45] changing sentiment right now are isolation and time.

Uh, and so it is, It is this sense of connection, to use your word, and then it is this resource of my time value. And most of the trends that I'm [00:39:00] seeing ladder up to one or the other of those. 

Neely: Yeah, I love that. I think like we were trying to recap the conversation, we're like, Oh, it's everything. Um, but no, I said about exactly,  uh, who's going to title this?

Um, no, I, this has been great. And I think, you [00:39:15] know, at the end of the day, If I could summarize this, it will be the people that are going to make the difference, right? So, the, the, the VP that's subbing in for the president at the board meeting, I mean, the slides will be up there, like ChatGBT [00:39:30] might've helped with.

These are some points you should cover. The way he engages that room, the way that he connects with the people, the board members that are asking questions, the way that he represents himself, the way that he represents his team. It's the humans that's going to make the difference in that [00:39:45] discussion. So it really, at that point, you know, AI is diminished to a tool.

And I think even as, you know, I've got two young kids as they're coming up, it is going to be less and less about skills because, you know, robots might be doing a whole lot more [00:40:00] tomorrow than they are today. You know, what is going to make a difference is. How you are as a human, right? How empathetic are you?

How kind are you? How respectful are you? You know, how humble are you? These are key elements that we're never going to teach the robots. At least I hope not. [00:40:15] But as you're talking about crafting experiences for your customer or crafting experiences for your employees, It's that human element that's the secret sauce, right?

And I think all we're trying to do here is find a way to process that or find a way to be [00:40:30] consistent with delivering that human element on a regular basis. 

Aransas: Beautifully said, Nealey. It's been such a joy to talk to you guys. I hope folks from your audience will check out our show. So many great episodes with so many really amazing and [00:40:45] insightful guests.

We really appreciate it. We're so lucky to get to learn from them episode after episode, and I hope fans of the Experience Strategy Podcast will check out your show. We'll have links to both shows in the notes and really look forward to talking to you guys again. Absolutely. 

Neely: [00:41:00] Absolutely. Thank you both. It was a pleasure.

Thank you. 

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